Quirky sized LWC sized watches

The watch movement sizing used in the UK & US was devised in Lancashire - the Swiss used "Ligne" but by the 1930s made most of them to fit "Lancashire" sized cases. Most US makers stuck to the even numbered sizes 12, 14, 16 etc.

 

The Lancashire Watch Company however made watches in several quirky sizes,this one is a size 14 ¾ but with the heavy case it ends up with the same externam diameter as most size 16s.

 

LWC 15 jewelled pin set watch, 1895

 LWC 15 jewelled pin set watch, 1895

 

Whilst this one for Kendal & Dent is a size 16 ¾

LWC 11 jewelled pin set watch 1900.

LWC 11 jewelled pin set watch 1900.

 

Dawson "Railway Lever"

For watch anoraks this is a an interesting watch.

 

 

Although branded the “English Railway Lever” don’t confuse it with American Railroad watches, the British railways had signalling and token systems to prevent train collisions and did not rely on timekeeping to prevent collisions as the American railroads did. This is a fairly basic 7 jewelled size 18 movement albeit one that was very well made and with Geneva stop gear to control mainspring pressure. And being in an expensive case it was probably never intended for use on the railways except perhaps by station masters and management. .

Apart from the rocking bar winding and setting mechanism, the movement could be a very early going barrel movement having a bridge for the 3^nd and 4^th wheels, as was normal for Fusee movements[i] from the 19^th century and which was retained in early going barrel movement allowing the same trains to be used for both forms. The lower balance jewel securing mechanism of a brass wedge is that used in the 17^th and early 18^th century watches.

But this movement was made in 1911.

It is signed by Dawson a Liverpool based watchmaker but marked “London”, the watch was however almost certainly made in Coventry, and probably by one of the last remaining small makers, Jos H Bird who’s initials are on under the dial.

The very heavy case has Chester hallmarks and is probably by Charles Harris of Coventry.

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[i] The bridge was required on a Fusee to help fit the chain which was done with the 3^rd wheel out of the watch which could then be replaced by removing the bridge.

Vine & Thompson Small Half Hunter, 11J, 1891.

A very rare survivor. Although signed by a London retailer and with a London hallmark this watch was almost certainly made in Coventry although I do not know by who, a larger version I have seen was signed by the Army & Navy Store but also not by the maker. Marked as a size 5 but measuring closer to a size 4 this would have been a Ladies watch or a Gent's Fob Watch.

The pin set movement has 11 jewels and functioning Geneva gear to control spring pressure, it has a true English Escapement with a Breguet sprung cut compensating balance.

The movement is engraved Vine & Thompson, 85, Aldersgate Street. E.C. London, Vine and Thompson, previously Thompson and Vine, are listed as Clockmakers working from 1868-1957.

The Consular style swing out case has London hallmarks for Sterling Silver, 1891 and the makers mark of William Bullock, Cherry St, Coventry.

Someone made a  transposition error with the serial number on the case with the 2nd and 3rd digits out of order. The case measures 1.6" / 4 cm excluding the pendant etc.

The English "Half-chronometer"

J.W. Benson "Observatory" watch made by Tavannes and
described  as a "Half-chronometer" as was the English made
Benson "Field" watch and many others.

The English description of a watch as being a "Half-chronometer" is, perhaps, a rather grandiose name for what the Americans termed an "adjusted" watch meaning a watch adjusted for temperature as explained in this Wikipedia entry.

This does not mean that other watches will not cope adequately with changes in temperature but that the "Adjusted" or "Half-chronometer" watch has been rigorously tested at extremes of temperature and adjusted to minimise errors.

Unfortunately most good quality English watches, particularly those by Benson, Rotherham and other good makers in Coventry and London plus most imported from Switzerland before the late 1930s and signed by English resellers are not marked "adjusted" so it is only possible to establish if they are by tracking down contemporary adverts such as the following.

From a J.W. Benson Sales catalogue from the late 1930s.

What size to buy?

Moved from the web site and updated.

Jump the next 3 paragraphs if you are a technophobe or just bored with the detail :)

The detail: 

 

Watch Sizes are specified by the diameter of the movement where it fits in the case, there are now two common measures, “Lancashire” for English and American watches and “Ligne” for Swiss.

An unrestored S12 fusee movement
with its carrier and oversized dial.

Lancashire starts at size 0 which is 1 5/30inch increasing by 1/30 inch per size. So the popular men’s size 16 is 1.7 inch and size 18 1.77inch but it is quite possible for a watch case to make a smaller movement look several sizes bigger although the dial remains the same size.

It was also common practice to mount 19th century English movements onto the back of a carrier two sizes bigger, the carrier attached to the larger size case and had the larger size dial on the other side so that it was indistinguishable from the larger size watch without opening it up.

Where quoted I normally use the nearest equivalent “Lancashire” size for Swiss watches.

As a rough guide the following table shows the approximate diameter of the watch for "normally" cased American and Swiss movements, some may be rather larger but a few can be smaller.

• S14 4.9 – 5.0 cm
• S16 5.0 – 5.2 cm
• S18 5.4 cm+

English pin set watches will typically be a little larger as will full plate watches (because they are thicker).

Movements of size 12 and below and size 18 and above can vary significantly in size when cased up, so on the web site I normally give the dimensions for each watch as part of the description.

Here are some general guidelines on what each size of watch is best suited for, clearly there is room for variation here particularly for ladies if they are wearing a waistcoat or carry the watch in a handbag. And although a Fob watch is normally defined as one below about size 8 it is really only limited by the size of the fob pocket! 



A Ladies size 6 Waltham, heavily patterned cases are
frequently used on these smaller watches.

Size 0

Ladies watches only, suitable for wearing on a neck chain as a pendant (but be careful not to swing it around too much and bash it on something) or as a brooch with a suitable attachment.

Size 6

Ladies, as size 0 or as a fob watch. Men, as a fob watch.

 

A size 12 Rotherham although tightly cased
for a pin set watch it is still 1.9" / 4.7cm
 in diameter, about the same an American size 14

Sizes 12

Getting rather large to be a Fob watch but some American size 12s will be OK used as above. Many old size 12 movements are put into size 14 cases with the use of a carrier as described above.

English pin set size 12s make a good sized mans watch.

 

 

Size 14 & 16



A size 16 hunter in a New Old Stock Dennison
case. A Hunter will always be a little bigger
than an open faced watch due to the space
 taken by the bezel and lid.

A common size in the nineteenth century in all forms, this became the “standard” man’s size for keyless watches in the twentieth century, these are generally quite slim so do not distort pockets as much as earlier key set watches.

This was the smallest size that could be certified as a “Railway” watch in the USA (beware of this term! Originally it defined an accurate and reliable timepiece suitable for controlling railroad traffic in the US, later it was picked up as a marketing ploy and appears on some really awful Swiss watches – you have been warned!).

 

A tightly cased Waltham 1892 railroad watch.

Size 18

Originally the watch to go for to show status and now very popular with collectors, particular of North American watches and it is frequently said the bigger the better. Some very fine watches were made in the calibre.

Size 20 & 22

As for Size 18 but really showing off, not that common and most in UK are key set from the front and made in the 1890’s and very early in the new century.

Size 24+

Are really too big to carry around but frequently would have had a special stand to convert them into something you could use as a travelling clock.

What affects the value of a watch?

Transferred from the web site faqs with some updating. 

A premium grade American railroad
watch movement by Waltham.

I think it would be useful to understand why watches come at different prices, this may help to focus on what is important to you in making the decision and how to get the best value (to you) for your money.

The simple answer is of course supply and demand but perhaps a more useful one for our purpose is “desirability”. Some aspects of what makes a desirable watch are fairly obvious and clear cut and so the more of these “boxes” a watch ticks (pun not intended but left in!) the more expensive it is going to be; but each individual will have their own view on what is desirable in a watch so may wish to select a watch or type of watch that presses their “buttons” but does not have some other attributes that increases price but is of little interest.

Here is an initial list, in no particular order, of things that may significantly affect the value of a watch - I suspect I’ll add more over time:

·       Condition.

·       Rarity.

·       Absolute age and also early or late examples.

·       Quality of design and construction.

·       Type of movement & escapement (see below).

·       American railroad watches will attract a significant premium, association with rail ways generally will also enhance value..

·       Features for accuracy and reliability (see below).

·       Method of winding and setting.

·       Certain Brands and / or makers.

·       Type of case and the material used.

·       A hunter or half hunter will cost more than a comparable open faced watch.

·       And did I mention condition?



This watch ticks many boxes, it is by J.W. Benson a top London maker
much collected, it is one of their higher grade watches, it is rare and in
first class condition. It is also a half hunter. It sold in a few minutes even
though it is one of the most expensive watches I have put on my web site,
even including most solid gold watches.

Of course a very old watch in awful condition is not going to be as valuable as a slightly younger one is excellent condition and it is the balance between these factors which is often so difficult to assess.

Other factors are more subjective such as:

·         Clear vs signed faces.

A bespoke 3 piece dial as on this Waltham will make it a bit more expensive
but it will also sell more quickly.

·         Flamboyant decoration of movements vs elegant simplicity.

·         Ornamentation and dedications on cases (can go either way).

A rare case like this will certainly add value, especially on a high grade
watch such as the 23J Waltham1899 Riverside Maximus in this one.

Types of popular movement:

In ascending order of value, other things being equal:

·         Going Barrel Pin Lever

·         Going Barrel Cylinder

·         Going Barrel English or Swiss Lever

Fusee Lever movements are likely to be old and fragile, a basic one will generally are not as desirable as an equivalent going barrel but good ones can get expensive. Verge fuse movement will be early 19^th century or earlier and in good condition can get very expensive. You will not find any pin lever watches on this site and very few cylinder watches, there will be the odd fusee but no Verge Fusee as they are too expensive for me to play with.

English Lever escapements come in two flavours, the true English lever with its “spiked” or “horned” escape wheel and a variation of the Swiss Lever which is laid out as an English lever but has a “Club tooth” Escape and which was normally described as an English Lever even though technically it wasn’t. There is not a lot of difference in value between them although many prefer the true English as being traditional although the Swiss variant is more efficient. True English Lever watches are rarer after about 1900 although companies such as Rotherham and J.W. Benson stuck with them into the 1930s.

Features for accuracy that add value:

·       Generally the more jewels the more expensive with good jewel placement also being a factor – see more detailed notes in this post.
·       Adjustment (see this nawcc wikki on the subject) for temperature, isochronism and / or in multiple positions. 

·       Screw set jewels tend to lead to higher prices than hand or machine set.

·       A cut compensating balance (mentioned in coverall or the Elinvar hairspring) is better than an early screwed balance without an Elinvar hairspring, is better than a solid balance but age and other factors muddy these waters.

·        Breguet sprung balance is generally preferred to a “standard” over-sprung or under-sprung balance.

·        Geneva Stop Gear, if still functional, is a plus point on early going barrel movements.

J.W. Benson movements in Dennison cases.

Large numbers of Benson cases were made by Benson Bros[i] (no relation) of Liverpool, but carried the J.W. Benson mark and for solid gold and silver the London assay marks.

A witness mark (just to the left of the case screw hole)
showing that the movement does not belong in this case.
Note the Dennison safety bow on the case.

Benson watches from the 1930s with “standard” sized movements by Tavannes are frequently seen on eBay in silver cases by Dennison, most of these are marriages probably using movements that originally had a solid gold case. These frequently have witness marks from other movements visible on the case as illustrated here (I don’t buy these watches except for spares so the example shown is the movement from the watch below placed in a case from a Waltham watch).

Some however do not bear witness marks but could still be marriages with cases originally from Tavannes watches.

A 1933 Tavannes movement for J.W. Benson in
a Dennison silver case hallmarked 1933

Whilst Benson could have used Dennison cases when short of their own, for quite a while I considered that the majority of these Dennison cased watches were marriages but then saw some with provenance covering 40 or 50 years and I began to wonder, whilst I am very sceptical[ii] about family history, a relatively recent history (when the owner was not trying to sell) probably precludes a watch having been recently re-cased.

Having done some research[iii] I found that the Benson Bros business, including the contract with J.W. Benson, was purchased by Dennison in the early 30s, case making was transferred to Handsworth whilst the original Benson Bros operation was turned over to repair work.

This makes more sense of watches from the 1930s occasionally having Dennison hallmarks. The date of the transfer is not known but was certainly complete by 1934. All of those that I have handled without witness marks showing re-casing, are hallmarked 1933 apart from one, the only datable Swiss Benson I have had from from 1934. So probably these watches came during the transfer of the business.
 

The back of the watch shown above.

The Dennison case shown here is confirmation of this as the date of the movement (from the serial number) matches that of the case. Also the case is not typically Dennison of the period as it lacks their normal patented “Safety bow”, as do all of the gold and silver cases in my mid 1930s J.W. Benson sales catalogue.

It is also possible that the case was originally made for Benson but was sent to Birmingham for assay due to a queue at London or it was made for another third party and diverted.

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[i] Previously the business founded by of R. Samuel, Benson Bros from c1894 and from 1902 owned by J.B. Eastham.

[ii] Well justified I think having been told several totally implausible histories saying for example that a hallmarked watch from the 1920’s was 19th century and the hallmarks were wrong, a London assay having been stamped with Birmingham date marks, because “it has to be that as it was definitely Great Gt… Grandad's 21^st Birthday present” - although not engraved as such .

[iii] Primarily from Priestley “Watch Case Makers of England”, NAWCC Spring 1994.

Why 16 & 19 Jewels on English Watches but few with 17?

A 16 jewel movement by Errington of Coventry.

Several quality English makers made 15, 16, 19 & 20 jewelled watches but rarely, if ever,  used 17 or 21. The first reason to spring to mind might be cost, there may be some truth in that but I think the real reasons are the very conservative nature of most English watch makers and alternative and maker preferred methods of adding jewels.

Jewels are used because they are hard wearing and smooth so the pivot hole does not go out of round and friction is reduced, if only some wheels are to be jewelled it is best to use them on wheels that are moving quickly and with gearing effects have the most impact on reducing the overall power requirement of the watch.

The basic 7 jewels on a lever watch are 2 hole jewels + 2 cap (or end) jewels (to reduce end float and to keep the shoulders of the pivot off of the jewel to reduce friction) for the balance, an impulse jewel on the roller and 2 on the lever pallet. After this the next pair of jewels would normally be put on the escape wheel. After that there is some disagreement as to where they should go, the options being:

1. On the lever.
2. On the seconds wheel.
3. As cap jewels on the escape.

An 11 Jewel movement by Rotherham
with hole and cap jewels on the
escape wheel.

Some makers go for option 1 although the lever does not go through 360 degrees which is why some go for option 2. Rotherham in particular will go for option 3 to further reduce friction and to increase stability at this critical point, this may also be a cheaper option.

After 11, additional jewels would normally be added in pairs moving towards the centre wheel until you get to 15 (or 19 for a Rotherham with cap jewels on the escape and lever).

At this point it is worth mentioning that the marketing men sometimes prevail over the watch makers and jewels were added just on the top plate where they can be seen and not on the face plate. This is waste of jewels as those on the slower turning wheels contribute little and the benefit of the jewels that are there is reduced. I see this quite frequently on Swiss watches for the English market and occasionally on American watches.

English watchmakers did not like putting jewels on the centre wheel, this is probably a legacy of very strong main springs in big movements and a concern that the pressure would break the jewel. When pressed a lot of makers, notably Errington, would put a centre wheel jewel just on the top plate where it would be seen and not on the face plate where the maximum pressure from the barrel would normally be.

A rare 20 jewel watch by
Rotherham of Coventry.

Rotherham and many of the better Coventry makers would go to 19 by putting cap jewels on the lever and the escape, ignoring the centre wheel (they did not advertise the fact by engraving the movement as having 19 jewels so to the uninitiated they look like 15 jewel movements). Some excellent movements were made this way.  If pushed to show a jewel on the centre wheel they would then follow the practice of adding a single jewel to end up with a 20 jewel watch but these are rare birds.

In American makers would make a 19J watch by jewelling all wheels and then either adding cap jewels to the escape or jewels to the barrel, something not seen on English watches.

The Safety Pinion (Fogg's patent)

A Reversing Pinion prior to assembly.

The Safety Pinion originated in 1865 when it was usually described as "Fogg's patent", it was intended to avoid damage to the movement in the event of a mainspring breakage, the spring being let down too quickly during maintenance or following failure of the click (ratchet stopping the mainspring arbor from "winding down" and forcing the barrel to move instead).

The problem was that with the very strong springs required at the time the backlash after a failure would go through the train and potentially break weaker parts, mainly I suspect the lever pallet and pallet jewels.

The solution is quite ingenious. Instead of the centre wheel pinion being fixed to the wheel / staff it is screwed on. In normal use the gear teeth on the mainspring barrel bear against the pinion and keep it screwed down.

A "Reversing Pinion" during assembly
but not yet screwed on.

If the pressure is suddenly reversed the pinion unscrews and no reverse power is applied to the rest of the movement.
This solution was initial used by Waltham and then by Elgin who presumably licenced it, but by the 1890's, if not earlier, the concept was more widely used in the USA (the example shown is from a Seth Thomas of 1896) and by a number of the larger makers in England including The Lancashire Watch Company and William Ehrhardt.

Waltham later introduced the "Safety Barrel" to address the same problem but as the amount of power a watch required reduce with the introduction of lighter movements, improved manufacturing tolerances and more jewelling, there was no longer a real need and safety pinions were discontinued.

Slow train, fast train

No not about railroad watches as such but about the frequency at which a watch balance turns. By the middle of the 19th century lever watches were pretty much standardised at 16,200 vibrations per hour (VPH). As watches got smaller and engineering tolerances got tighter makers started to move towards a faster beat of 18,000 VPH, usually referred to as a "Quick Train".

As usual the Americans moved first with Waltham changing the beat of their size 18 full plate 1877 model to 18,000 after launching it at 16,200 and the Illinois Watch Company changed quickly in about 1879.

The conservative English trade were, as usual, quite a way behind probably not helped by the investment required in redesigning their watches to change the gearing in the train and retooling costs which would have been more significant for the much smaller English companies than for the large American operations.

Generally it was the early 1890's before the Coventry and Lancashire trades started to use the faster train, led not unnaturally by newly introduced keyless three-quarter plate designs with some of the older full plate designs being allowed to die a natural death, particular Fusee movements,  and others being changed mid life or when Swiss Lever escapements started to replace the English Lever.

The London trade were even more conservative with some makers, notably P & A Guye and J.W. Benson persisting with the slower train up until around about the first World War. The lovely Benson Ludgate pictured was made in 1912 still running at 16,200 which does give it a very nice "majestic" tick.

Wrist watches, as one might expect, continued the development and my 1980s Rolex runs at 19,800 VPH with later ones running even faster.

A Rare Rotherham and a bit about hairspings & balances.

A Size 12 Rotherham for Hoefler &
Co of Devenport. 19 Jewels, 1901.

This is at first sight a normal high end size 12 Rotherham with 19 jewels but two things make it unusual, first is still has an original watch paper in the back as described in my last post, but more important is the very rare balance assembly.

Normally these movements have a cut compensating balance with a normal steel Breguet hairspring, however in the late 1890's a new alloy known as "Elenvar" was devised by Charles Édouard Guillaume (who got the 1920 Nobel prize for physics for the development), its key property was that unlike steel its flexibility (modulus of elasticity) did not change with temperature. When used as a hairspring it removed the need for a compensating balance.

A very rare solid balance with an
Elenvar Breguet hairspring.

Most companies implemented the Elenvar hairspring with a screwed balance which allowed the balance to be balanced fairly quickly (as a car wheel with a new tyre) and the weight and number of screws could be used to adjust the moment of inertia to match the hairspring to make the watch run too time. 
 
With this movement Rotherham tried a different route and used a traditional 3 armed solid balance which is probably gold. Balancing and tuning was done by removing slight amounts of material from the balance as can be seen from the picture to the right..

This is the only watch I have seen with this arrangement and it is likely that Rotherham only made a few, probably because the amount of skilled work required to set up the balance would more than likely have made it more expensive than the normally sprung cut compensating balance.

A rare pair of papers.

click the picture for a larger view

It is very rare these days to find watches with watch papers intact (they are collectable in their own right), I had only 2 or 3 from the last 600 watches. And today two turned up together, I knew one was coming but the second was a nice surprise.

 

The papers were used for advertising and would have been put in by sellers or repairers and occasionally you find a watch with a stack of them but usually they are glued together, to the case and / or are falling to pieces. Both of these are original to the watch and have the same retailers names as are shown on the watch faces.

 

The blue one is on a Rotherham from 1901 retailed by Hoefler of Devonport. The watch itself is something rather special - watch this space!

The red paper is on a Waltham 1908-610 half hunter sold by Harral of Barnsley, it has the serial number of the movement on it and is dated 11 years after the watch was made so presumably they were warranting a repair or they had bought back the watch and had resold it.

Dating Pocket Watches.

Revised and extended December 2016 from the original post August 2015

Dating watches can be a problem but here are a few ways that it is done.

American Watches

A Waltham 1892-Vanguard dated
to 1902 by the serial number, but
probably re-cased (see below).

These are generally the easiest as for many makes, such as Waltham and Hamilton, production records are still extant and enthusiasts in the US have put a huge amount of effort into putting them into online databases so by taking the serial number of the movement (not the case number!) and entering it you can get the production date usually to within a year or possibly two but sometimes to within a month.

Details of the type of watch may also be provided although there are some errors largely due to mixed production runs (e.g. lever and pendant set, etc..) and the occasional transcription error. The original Waltham database is maintained by the NAWCC but the most comprehensive site I have found is The Pocket Watch database.

Swiss Watches

Are more problematic, of the makes I regularly deal with, Omega have published the dates that each million watches were produced so by interpellation the production date can be determined within a year or two. Dates are known for Zenith and some for Longines, & Baume.

A Cyma movement with the serial
number under the dial

For most of the other makes the data is not generally available or, as is the case with Revue Thomman, the movements do not carry a meaningful serial number, just a 2 or 3 digit number to identify watches within a batch of production.

Having had a lot of watches by Cyma and Tavannes I have been able to build up a good database of serial numbers vs date for production between c1930 and 1938 using the silver hallmarks (see below) which is now good enough to identify the date to within a year. See this post for details.

Beyond this is comes down to experience and identifying key features such as machine set jewels which determines the earliest possible date.

English Watches.

An LWC movement showing the
serial number under the dial
dated to 1897.

Are very difficult, as far as I know production records are only available for the Lancashire Watch Company and those that are not accessible.

Other makes (assuming you can identify the maker!) are difficult as several companies appear to have multiple number sequences, indeed occasionally an Errington will turn up with two serial numbers one from each major sequence.

Generally it is therefore necessary to reply on silver case hallmarks or when in a filled or rolled gold case to compare with previous dated examples which may not be as reliable.

Silver Cases.

Silver hallmarks for 1903 by the
Birmingham Assay. The movement
is a Waltham 1899-620 also 1903.

English silver and gold case hallmarks are unique in having a date year, although until 1974 this is not quite in line with the calendar year and varied by Assay house with the Birmingham "year" starting in July and the London "year" in May, normally I refer to just the starting year, so Birmingham 1908 would indicate that the case was assayed between July 1908 and June 1909.

Some Swiss watches have only the Swiss hallmarks but others have English import marks.

For older English watches this is generally a reliable method of dating but with the introduction of the standard watch case we start to have problems due to recent re-casing of orphaned movements into orphaned cases, a problem which appears to be getting worse judging from what I see on eBay.

A subsequent post here will look at  how to identify re-cased watches. See also J.W. Benson movements in Dennison cases.

Naming Confusion!

Here is a good example of why attribution can be a problem.

This good quality 16 jewel watch is signed by well known makers & retailers Kendal and Dent - Dent made the clock that drives "Big Ben". But the movement is signed DF&C for Dimier Freres et Cie part of a long established Swiss watch making dynasty, but in this case the movement was actually made by Review Thommen, probably for the London branch of Dimier who were major watch importers.

Watch packaging

It never ceases to amaze me how poorly most people pack the watches I buy in - or how often the watch actually survives, I have a strong suspicion that watches gummed up with old oil are more robust than a newly restored one, which is rather annoying!

The main problem I find is that where people go further than just putting the watch into a jiffy bag (or envelope!) they tend to protect against crushing, against which the watch is actually quite resistant, rather than against shock which is the bigger risk. They also tend to wrap lots of tape all round the watch and / or packing which contributes nothing to its safety and by making it difficult to unpack increases the risk of damage after it has arrived.

I started off packing watches in a small box wrapped in bubble wrap in a padded bag, over time I used more wrap and a bigger bag then replaced the bag with a cardboard box which although more expensive did, with the elimination of sticky tape, turn out to be quicker to pack and I suspect also discourages rough handling.

Here is the latest and hopefully final version of my packaging. The watch goes into a jewellery pouch and the pouch into a sealed plastic bag to protect against condensation particularly if transported in an unpressurised / unheated aircraft hold which frequently happens even on shipments within the UK, although international shipments present the bigger risk.

Then into a small but strong cardboard box with padding top and bottom. Annoyingly the boxes come with just one bit of padding so more has to be added.

Next into a medium sized box with a lot of bubble wrap.

Ready to go except for the address label and packing slip.

Revue Thommen Movements

The range of size 16 movements by Revue Thommen appears to be very large, but all it not quite as it seems.

Some Revue Thommen Movements - Click to enlarge.

 

These movement look fairly different, in fact apart from materials (and the gilt ones were also made with the nickel finish and vice-versa) they are essentially the same. Shown are some hunter and open faced versions but all variants were available as either.

The winding / setting mechanism, barrel, gear train and lever pallet are exactly the same (for watches made at about the same time) and for setting can have, without modification, a long winding stem as shown in the two centre examples or a short one for cases with a captive crown and stem. The balance assembly on all of these movements may be either  over-sprung or Breguet with either a cut compensating balance or a screwed balance (with Elenvar spring). The number of jewels can be varied and a micro adjusted used instead of the standard index for further variation.

The top plates and cocks are clearly different but the main body of the movement is the same except for being drilled differently to take the two studs and between 1 and 4 screws used to locate and secure each cock and plate.

A hint for Chronograph Owners.

The arrival of this Chronograph now restored reminded me that some chronograph users are abusing their watches. DO NOT leave the watch for extended periods wound but stopped with the "top" button as this will prematurely age the mainspring.

Stopping it before carrying in luggage or sending it through the post is however probably a good idea as it may help protect the balance.

The Coventry made size 22 movement has 13 jewels and Geneva Gear and is an early one from 1879. The Case is by WG Hammond of Coventry.